Interview Part 3: Kaoru Watanabe talks Kodo, Odaiko, Chichibu Yataibayashi, and Miyake Jima Kamitsuki Kiyari Daiko

This is the third interview in my series with Kaoru. I highly recommend checking out the other two if you haven’t yet. It’s always a great pleasure to sit down with Kaoru and ask about his thoughts, experiences, and many interesting anecdotes. Beyond simply enjoying the conversation, I think we are providing important insights for anyone wanting to expand their knowledge and perspective.

This interview happened exactly one week after I had attended the Kodo concert titled Warabe. The timing was coincidental but I took the opportunity to ask Kaoru about his time with Kodo, especially relating to the philosophy and culture around learning and performing traditional arts such as the ohayashi (music) from Chichibu and the Kamitsuki district of Miyake Jima. This conversation includes a lot of history and information that are invaluable in understanding Kodo as well as these traditional art forms. As we referenced near the end, we had also planned to talk about fue but ran out of time because of the depth and breadth of this discussion. We will get together for that topic in the near future. I hope you share my feeling of gratitude to Kaoru for taking the time to thoughtfully engage in these fascinating conversations. The supplemental material he provided (below) is a great resource for delving deeper into the topics covered in this interview. Feel free to send me comments, questions, or requests anytime.

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Supplemental material from Kaoru:

Miyamoto Tsuneichi is a scholar who greatly influenced Den Tagayasu and recommended he set up the artisan village in Sado.
https://books.google.com/books/about/The_Forgotten_Japanese.html?id=q2EbG_NM1xwC&source=kp_author_description

The following are all dances I have learned from local practitioners. The first one is the one we're not allowed to perform, while the others we are. With Shishiodori, I not only did tours performing it, but I made the costume by hand! The Kakinoura Ondeko is the first of these dances I learned. The town between Kakinoura and Iwakubi that I couldn't recall is Odawara. A note that perhaps many people don't realize is that at Kodo we learn as much dancing as drumming. This is only a partial list of the dances (and fue/taiko/uta that goes with it) that I learned during my short time there.

Kurokawa Sansa, Morioka Prefecture
https://youtu.be/kw4JXAXMVCE?si=xmHflYyj34ptSvkm

Onikenbai, Iwate Prefecture
https://youtu.be/2FGN80g5ZU8?si=GJWD0We2m51Co-Ow

Shishiodori, Iwate Prefecture
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IXZTOoUiFUc

Kakinoura Ondeko
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RyI0yX1jtao

Iwakubi Ondeko
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WKpp2kKKTmE

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Website
http://www.watanabekaoru.com

Youtube channel
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCfBL_1I2mRPcVK2gvyRAeNA

Instagram
https://www.instagram.com/kaorufue/

Kaoru Watanabe Taiko Center
http://www.taikonyc.com

Acclaimed composer and instrumentalist Kaoru Watanabe's work is grounded in traditional Japanese music while imbued with contemporary jazz, improvisation, and experimental music elements. His signature skill of infusing Japanese culture with disparate styles on the shinobue flutes and taiko and other Japanese percussion has made him a much-in-demand collaborator working with such iconic artists as André 3000, Wes Anderson, Mikhail Baryshnikov, Laurie Anderson, Jason Moran, Yo-Yo Ma, Japanese National Living Treasure Bando Tamasaburo and Rhiannon Giddens. In 2024, Watanabe launched Bloodlines Interwoven, a festival celebrating music and diaspora, presented by Baryshnikov Arts and funded by the Mellon Foundation. Featuring a broad range of groundbreaking musicians, from Mino Cinelu, Nasheet Waits, Adam O'Farrill, Alicia Hall Moran, Layale Chaker, Martha Redbone, Du Yun, and many more, the festival was a paradigm-shifting musical exploration of cultural roots, identity, history.

Born to Japanese parents who were long-time St Louis Symphony Orchestra members, Watanabe began training at a young age, eventually graduating from the Manhattan School of Music, where he studied Black American jazz music. He then moved to Japan and became the first American to perform with and lead the internationally acclaimed taiko performing arts group Kodo. Acting as Artistic Director of Kodo's Earth Celebration festival, inviting such artists as Zakir Hussain, Giovanni Hidalgo, and other masters of music from across the globe, he first saw how profound cross-cultural collaboration could be: people who don’t share a common language can find ways to unite in musical conversation when done with a sense of mutual respect, open-mindedness, an open heart, and a desire to connect. In 2008, after ten transformative years in Japan, which left him deeply connected to his heritage and the land from which his parents came, he left Kodo. He returned to New York to weave together all the musical threads of his experiences.

Watanabe’s compositions draw lines between distant points—Japan and America, ancient history and modern politics, and Eastern and Western music. Looking for the sympathetic vibrations that emerge, he weaves together Buddhist chants reimagined as antipolice brutality protests, WWII-era ZERO kamikaze fighter planes, the Sengoku Civil War era, and the culture wars of today’s America. In his work, Watanabe introduces sounds from a distant past to the 21st century, expressing the many layers of his identity and culture. Watanabe has performed his compositions with such artists as Kodo, Yo-Yo Ma and the Silkroad Ensemble, and The Sydney Symphony Orchestra, with whom he debuted two pieces for shinobue, voice, taiko and orchestra at the Sydney Symphony Hall.

He acted as an advisor and was a featured musician on Wes Anderson’s Isle of Dogs, and he is featured on the Silkroad Ensemble’s Grammy Award-winning album Sing Me Home. He also created music for Martin Scorcese’s Silence and Netflix’s Ultraman: Rising, and perhaps his greatest accomplishment was providing the jazz flute stylings of the Pied Piper in Shrek 4ever After.

As an educator, Watanabe has taught courses at Princeton, Wesleyan, and Boston Conservatory and was an artist-in-residence at Loyola University. He has taught workshops across North and South America, Europe, and East and Southwest Asia.

Watanabe’s drums are provided by Miyamoto Unosuke Shoten, a mikoshi shrine and traditional instrument maker founded in 1861. His flutes are provided by Ranjo, a master craftsman based in Chiba Prefecture who makes instruments for many of the top musicians in Japan. One of the highest honors of Watanabe’s life is when Ranjo declared, “Watanabe possesses the greatest sound on the shinobue in the world.”

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Interview Part 2: Kaoru Watanabe talks music, food, taiko, and cultural appropriation

This interview is a follow-up conversation I had with Kaoru after we had previously talked about studying and etiquette in Japan. If you haven’t checked it out, I would recommend listening to it because provides some foundation for the topics covered in this second interview.

https://www.eienhunterishikawa.com/blog/interview-kaoru-watanabe-talks-japanese-etiquette-studying-teaching-and-performing

We had recorded this part 2 interview a couple of years ago and I recently edited the audio to make it available here. Listening to our conversation, I was struck once again by Kaoru’s perceptive insights about food, taiko, and how to think discerningly about cultural appropriation. He is a serious student of music and culture, and I always recognize his strong passion and integrity whenever we have a chance to hang out. Sometimes I think Kaoru and I are more than like-minded. There are times where he says something and it’s word-for-word the same way I think of it. Did he get that from me? Or did I forget I got that from him? Or just coincidence stemming from our personal tastes and past experiences? This conversation features a lot of those moments.

I’m not sure if the ideas in this interview might be perceived by some people as contentious. To me it was a genuine and honest conversation about how Kaoru and I think about these topics. I’m always grateful for his willingness to make time and discuss whatever I’m interested in asking him. I hope you find this interview as interesting as I did.

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Website
http://www.watanabekaoru.com

Youtube channel
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCfBL_1I2mRPcVK2gvyRAeNA

Instagram
https://www.instagram.com/kaorufue/

Kaoru Watanabe Taiko Center
http://www.taikonyc.com

Kaoru Watanabe, a New York-based composer and musician specializing in Japanese flutes and percussion, works with such groundbreaking artists as Laurie Anderson, Mikhail Baryshnikov, Yo-Yo Ma, Wes Anderson, Bando Tamasaburo, Simone Leigh, and Jason Moran. Watanabe is known for the artful and innovative ways he merges traditional Japanese music and theater elements with the contemporary Western world.

Originally from St. Louis, MO, where his parents played in the St. Louis Symphony Orchestra, Watanabe played classical music as a child before going to the Manhattan School of Music to study jazz flute and saxophone. He then spent a decade in Japan, re-discovering and diving deep into his cultural roots as a member of the iconic taiko drumming ensemble Kodo. Watanabe studied a wide variety of traditional Japanese folk dances, songs, drumming, Noh, Kyogen, tea ceremony, woodworking, and rice farming to deepen his understanding of Japanese culture and the function and place of the performing arts within it.

As a solo artist, Watanabe seeks to collaborate with artists who embrace both tradition and innovation, such as Eva Yerbabuena, Imani Uzuri, Tamangoh, Adam Rudolph, Alicia Hall Moran, Rhiannon Giddens, Jen Shyu, Susie Ibara, Hassan Hakmoun, Zakir Hussein, Gamin, Vernon Reid, Wu Man, Tseyen Tserendorj, and many others.

As a composer, Watanabe writes for various, often unconventional instrumentations and explores a wide variety of compositional techniques. He has written orchestral works for the Sydney Symphony, premiering them at the Sydney Opera House. Watanabe composed music for the Academy Award-nominated Isle of Dogs soundtrack and three separate commissions for Yo-Yo Ma's Silkroad ensemble. Watanabe's compositions often explore social justice, politics, history, and heritage. He has written a piece called Iki, meaning "breath," a mantra-like performance-art piece for Eric Garner. Watanabe has written for prepared koto about the Japanese fighter planes used in WWII, a symbol of both the beauty and genius of Japanese culture and the evil and destruction it perpetrated. During the pandemic, Watanabe developed a body of work that uses electronics to sample and playback his flutes, drums, and voice live, allowing him to create ensemble works solo that he titled INCENSE.

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Interview: Kaoru Watanabe talks Japanese etiquette, studying, teaching, and performing

photo by Max Whittaker

I recently had the pleasure of talking with Kaoru Watanabe, a friend and wonderful musician based in New York. We first met while I was living in Honolulu and playing with the Kenny Endo Taiko Ensemble. Kaoru and I have performed together in a variety of configurations over the years and I always have a fantastic time. I especially appreciate his musical openness and keen ear which constantly kindle spontaneity and real interaction on stage as we improvise. Kaoru, like myself, is all about the music, and I think this philosophical bond can be heard in our conversation.

For this interview, I asked Kaoru about etiquette in Japanese culture and more specifically within traditional arts. My interest in this topic has grown as I learn more about 礼儀作法 (reigi sahou, or etiquette system) through my Edo Bayashi studies with Kyosuke Suzuki sensei. At the beginning of the interview, I mention Suzuki sensei’s video interviews I produced for the Online Edo Bayashi Gathering in February 2021. Here is the link where you can find three videos dedicated to this topic:

https://vimeo.com/showcase/7974529

As I had anticipated, Kaoru shared valuable insights he gained through a wealth of experiences in the US and Japan. I can relate to his fluency in both cultures so it felt easy and natural to conduct the interview. The included music are excerpts from three of Kaoru’s pieces: Merge, Shinobu, and Bloodlines. I am grateful to Kaoru for his time and look forward to the next time we can record another interview on a different topic.

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Website
http://www.watanabekaoru.com

Youtube channel
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCfBL_1I2mRPcVK2gvyRAeNA

Instagram
https://www.instagram.com/kaorufue/

Kaoru Watanabe Taiko Center
http://www.taikonyc.com

Kaoru Watanabe, a New York-based composer and musician specializing in Japanese flutes and percussion, works with such groundbreaking artists as Laurie Anderson, Mikhail Baryshnikov, Yo-Yo Ma, Wes Anderson, Bando Tamasaburo, Simone Leigh, and Jason Moran. Watanabe is known for the artful and innovative ways he merges traditional Japanese music and theater elements with the contemporary Western world.

Originally from St. Louis, MO, where his parents played in the St. Louis Symphony Orchestra, Watanabe played classical music as a child before going to the Manhattan School of Music to study jazz flute and saxophone. He then spent a decade in Japan, re-discovering and diving deep into his cultural roots as a member of the iconic taiko drumming ensemble Kodo. Watanabe studied a wide variety of traditional Japanese folk dances, songs, drumming, Noh, Kyogen, tea ceremony, woodworking, and rice farming to deepen his understanding of Japanese culture and the function and place of the performing arts within it.

As a solo artist, Watanabe seeks to collaborate with artists who embrace both tradition and innovation, such as Eva Yerbabuena, Imani Uzuri, Tamangoh, Adam Rudolph, Alicia Hall Moran, Rhiannon Giddens, Jen Shyu, Susie Ibara, Hassan Hakmoun, Zakir Hussein, Gamin, Vernon Reid, Wu Man, Tseyen Tserendorj, and many others.

As a composer, Watanabe writes for various, often unconventional instrumentations and explores a wide variety of compositional techniques. He has written orchestral works for the Sydney Symphony, premiering them at the Sydney Opera House. Watanabe composed music for the Academy Award-nominated Isle of Dogs soundtrack and three separate commissions for Yo-Yo Ma's Silkroad ensemble. Watanabe's compositions often explore social justice, politics, history, and heritage. He has written a piece called Iki, meaning "breath," a mantra-like performance-art piece for Eric Garner. Watanabe has written for prepared koto about the Japanese fighter planes used in WWII, a symbol of both the beauty and genius of Japanese culture and the evil and destruction it perpetrated. During the pandemic, Watanabe developed a body of work that uses electronics to sample and playback his flutes, drums, and voice live, allowing him to create ensemble works solo that he titled INCENSE.

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Interview: Kiyoshi Nagata talks Daihachi Oguchi, Kodo, and the taiko artist life

Kiyoshi Nagata

I had a fun time talking with Kiyoshi Nagata, the founder and leader of Nagata Shachu based in Toronto. We first met in Vancouver at the 2008 Regional Taiko Gathering, and I remember how his workshops and concert performance were all great. In this conversation, I learned a lot about Kiyoshi's interesting background which included training from Osuwa Daiko's Daihachi Oguchi as well as Kodo's apprenticeship program. Nagata Shachu, his professional taiko ensemble, keeps a busy schedule with tours, recordings, and an impressive array of artistic collaborations. One of the most interesting aspects of Kiyoshi's group is the large number original compositions they have created and performed. His website lists this repertoire along with many other informative resources so I would encourage everyone to check it out at the link below. Another topic Kiyoshi discussed in depth was his teaching philosophy. I wanted to hear his perspective because he has taught taiko classes for credit at the University of Toronto and public classes at the Royal Conservatory of Music.

Kiyoshi kindly sent me his newest CD/DVD set called Toronto Taiko Tales, and I have included some music from the album in the interview. I enjoyed it for the original compositions as well as the quality of the audio recording. The pieces are Hana, Enya Totto, Taichi no Sakebi, Tokiwa, Zare Shamisen, and Araumi. His youtube channel is full of concert footage so you can get a glimpse into the work of Nagata Shachu.

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Kiyoshi Nagata

Kiyoshi Nagata, founder and artistic director of Nagata Shachu, has been performing in a career that spans 35 years. His principal studies were with Daihachi Oguchi (as artistic director and performer of the Toronto-based, Suwa Daiko from 1982 to 1992) and with Kodo (as an apprentice from 1993 to 1994). With the assistance of a Chalmers Performing Arts Training Grant in 1999, Kiyoshi studied classical percussion with Paul Houle at the Royal Conservatory of Music in Toronto.

Links
www.nagatashachu.com
facebook.com/nagatashachu
www.youtube.com/nagatashachu

Since 1998 Kiyoshi has taught a credit course in taiko at the University of Toronto’s Faculty of Music. From 2003 to 2011, he established a public taiko course at the Royal Conservatory of Music in Toronto. For eight years, he instructed two community groups, Isshin Daiko in Toronto and Do-Kon Daiko in Burlington, which he helped establish in 1995. Kiyoshi is also regularly invited by universities and taiko groups to conduct workshops and present lectures.

In 1994, Kiyoshi founded the cross-cultural percussion ensemble, Humdrum, whose debut Toronto performance was ranked fourth in Now Magazine’s “Top Ten Concerts of 1995”. He has composed and performed taiko music for dance, theatre, film and radio and continues to collaborate with artists from all genres of music including traditional Japanese instrumentalists.